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Chanel buttons on Renfrew jacket?

Discussion in 'PUBLIC Vintage Fashion - Ask Questions Get Answers' started by zannew, Oct 22, 2010.

  1. zannew

    zannew Registered Guest

    I was wondering if these could be Chanel buttons? Would someone have put them on this Renfrew jacket? Any ideas would be appreciated.

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  2. UndoneMrs

    UndoneMrs Registered Guest

    Hi there, you could check the back of the buttons to see if they are signed. On vintage and more contemp pieces the buttons are usually signed on the back.
     
  3. UndoneMrs

    UndoneMrs Registered Guest

    Also, they may have put it on because the jacket style which is nicely made and reminiscent of Chanel. Check the bottom hem for a chain, though I don't think Chanel would ever allow someone to brand their textile company on their pieces.
     
  4. secondlooks

    secondlooks Alumni

    that is also the fabric (Linton Tweeds) that Chanel uses
     
  5. zannew

    zannew Registered Guest

    Interesting...Did she ever collaborate with other designers or do you think Renfrew was trying his best to make something just like Chanel?
     
  6. bycin

    bycin Guest

    Are the buttons authentic? Maybe not but I can't tell either way from the photos. Reason I ask is some of my peers in, then, investment banking in NYC would go to the garment district and get knock-off chanel buttons and sew them on anything well made that kind of resembled a Chanel cut so they could to get the look.

    I kid you not.
     
  7. zannew

    zannew Registered Guest

    I don't know if they are authentic or not. Someone here said to see if they were signed on the back. I cannot detect a signature. But, they do not look like they were sewn on after the fact. They are reinforced on the inside with a button "guard", if that's the right term. Also, there is an extra button sewn at the bottom in the lining.

    I would like to list this beautiful blazer but I am not sure what I should say - Renfrew jacket with Chanel buttons? Or, Chanel look-alike blazer? Hmmm...it's a mystery.
     
  8. poppysvintageclothing

    poppysvintageclothing VFG Board Member Staff Member VFG Past President

    If you are planning to list it on eBay as there is no Chanel label, there is a good chance they will pull the listing off, if you mention the Chanel name.
     
  9. Jonathan

    Jonathan VFG Member

    It looks to me to date before Karl was appointed in 83 and the Chanel label had slipped dramatically in prestige. After Coco died in 71 the label became mostly an old lady clothing style. Holt Renfrew is the store, although they did have things made for them under the Holt's name. They are kind of the Bergdorf's of Canada and have sold high end designer clothing and imported couture, including a special line from Dior since the early 1950s. I have seen other head scratching variations of labels and trademark items from Holts - I have a YSL dress with no YSL label in it and I think they often worked out deals with manufacturers to create adaptations. I think because this jacket is from that period between Coco and Karl, it could be real, and just some version of an adaptation made for Holt Renfrew using the same materials and findings of couture Chanel.
     
  10. zannew

    zannew Registered Guest

    Thanks, Mary Jane. I did not know that.
     
  11. Someone here found an article a while back that confirmed Holt's had licenses to do adaptations of Dior, YSL and the like. I don't remember Chanel being part of the list, but the list was incomplete with an ...

    MJ is correct they may pull the listing if you use the name Chanel, but you can say double C logo buttons.
     
  12. zannew

    zannew Registered Guest

    Wow! Thank you all for that great info! I am surper excited that it could be a "real" adaptation! I wish it fit me!
     
  13. zannew

    zannew Registered Guest

    I would guess the value would be less than half of what it would be if it had a Chanel label - am I correct?
     
  14. MyVintageCocktail

    MyVintageCocktail VFG Member

    I don't know eBay's very specific rules on this sort of thing. But it seems to me that if Holt Renfrew did have license to sell authorized Chanel adaptations, and I suspect that Jonathan is right that this could be the case, that you could say in a listing something like "retailer Holt Renfrew often sold authorized adaptations of designs from major design houses, and we believe this piece is a Chanel adaptation." Or, "We believe this is an authorized adaptation done for high-end retailer Holt Renfrew, which carried adaptation lines from many major design houses."

    As long as you do not use "Chanel" in the title and do not pretend to claim this is from Chanel, and, in fact, highlight the word adaptation in some fashion, not sure they would yank this. Or, they might, until somebody over there actually took the time to read the copy in the listing. I think the biggest issue is people passing off fake Chanels as real. But an adaptation by agreement is not a fake. And designer adaptations are not unusual in the fashion world by any means. I see them in hats a lot.

    You might try writing to Chanel to ask if, in the past, they ever had an agreement with Holt Renfrew.
     
  15. vertugarde

    vertugarde Alumni

    I know the Linton Tweeds factory and visited it a couple of times as a student and designer. I also worked with one of their weave designers.

    What is the provenance of the jacket? I don't know where you are located. It could be a sample piece.

    You'll probably find some clues by reading the history link on the Linton Tweeds website and I quote;

    "A ground-breaking trip to Japan found the Japanese very interested in fabric used by Chanel.
    Visits to America and Canada were made in search of new customers to replace those now out of business.
    The long association with the loss-making couture business in Paris began to bear fruit as the fashion houses began to introduce ready-to-wear collections..."

    http://www.lintondirect.info/history.html
     
  16. bycin

    bycin Guest

    Be very, very careful about using the Chanel name in any listing (ebay, etsy and so on) as their legal department WILL contact you and threaten to sue you if you don't remove the listing. Been there, done that. Trust me. They do not like the name being tossed around lightly and have a staff keeping an eye out.
     
  17. MyVintageCocktail

    MyVintageCocktail VFG Member

    Well, I'm wondering.... What can "they" do if indeed something is a legal Chanel adaptation and a seller is only stating the facts in a listing, rather than claiming an item is an authentic Chanel when it is not? This assumes, of course, that someone can verify that point.

    Surely neither eBay nor Chanel can sue someone for an accurate and truthful description? And they certainly can't stop people from selling Chanel items, authentic or adapted, that they legally own? How could they do that? How could someone get sued for telling the truth? God knows eBay allows fraudulent listings with regularity, even after they have been alerted to the fact that the items or the listings are fraudulent....
     
  18. bycin

    bycin Guest

    vintagebaubles, I don't know what they can or can't do but I know that they have a legal team. And my experience wasn't pleasant.
     
  19. Catbooks1940s

    Catbooks1940s VFG Member

    this is a curious piece.

    just wondering, does it have a chain stitched into the hem, and are the buttons on the cuffs functional?
     
  20. Catbooks1940s

    Catbooks1940s VFG Member

    i have had authentic buttons that weren't stamped on the reverse, btw. some are, some aren't.
     

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