dating fine instarsia knitted sweater vest / tank top

I just knew, when I held this that it was early, but how early? I'm confident of no later than early 1960's, but really I'm thinking 30s or 40s, it's a very fine knit, 22 stitches to the inch. What do you call this technique of pattern insertion? It looks like fairisle on the outside, but inside there no strands that carry over, it is all worked into the stitches.
Do you think this is womens or mens? or was...? the bust is 36" before stretch. Both dress forms are 38". There is no shaping, just different stitches. Because of the bottom half it stretches over the man's shape, and clings on the woman's, though you don't get the gaping arms on the man's so I'm leaning that way. I'm wondering if it was originally a jumper with sleeves and a higher neck that has later been altered, as the thread used for the decorative scallop stitching is a brighter green than the thread used for the overlocking underneath, and there is a bit too much selvedge in the shoulders which looks as though it has possibly been cut, a long time ago (the edges of it are fuzzy now). The overlocking has relatively long loops, neat but not very tight. The V side is vertical, the straight side slants one loop to the left. I wish I could find that overlocking guide now, I'm sure that would give me some indication of the age of the overlocking.

 

Thanks Karin yes I agree it was probably machine knitted, is that why the stitches don't carry over underneath do you think? I watched a great programme last week called Fabric of Britain which had an episode on knitting. They went to a very old company in Derby I think that still uses the same machines they used to make full body undergarments on from pre-central heating days. They were also an incredibly fine knit.
Any ideas on age?

 

Hi Melanie,

I agree that it's likely an upcycled top, refashioned from a jumper and machine knitted - as to age, my question is about fabric content. If it's pre '60s I'd expect pure wool and '60s or '70s would probably (but not necessarily) be a wool and synthetic mix or pure acrylic.

I have an easy test for wool: just wet a little bit of it. Wet wool has a very distinctive smell, you'll soon know if it's pure or not.

 

Another vote for upcycled in the late 60s to early 70s. It was a way to get that look that was popular at the time. The color would mesh with that time frame too, though I suppose the original sweater might be a bit older, or not.

 

Linda, your pic is for thermal underwear - you can still get them, in fact I have several. Modern styles look the same as your pic so they may not be vintage. They're for wearing under your clothes in winter, not necessarily for skiing or outdoor sports. I wear them around the house in winter or under tops. Mine are all black but they come in white and skin tones too. They are shaped so they don't create bulk under your clothes.

 

I've bought them from various Australian department shops - these names probably won't mean anything to you but Dimmeys, Myers and David Jones. I still have a good stash so haven't bought any for about a decade so it's possible that particular style isn't available any more but I certainly bought cream knit spencers just like yours in about 1999-2002. I have a black one like that with a wide scoop neckline, it's a New Zealand brand called "Jockey" and it's nice enough that I wear it as a top with skirts.

 

I shall beg to differ Linda - I can see Melanie's worn over a long sleeved blouse, perhaps with boofy bishop sleeves and button cuffs. The knit is chunkier than yours, which has a fine nylon mix - spencers and thermals tend to be fairly lightweight although I haven't seen all types.

I was born with a built in magnet for finding old fashioned styles of clothing - even if they're rare, I'm drawn to them irresistibly. I agree that Marks and Spencers would be a good source for this sort of product.

 

Not that I'm aware of: I just call it "deep waist ribbing" as it's part of the knit. In more modern times, the ribbing is a separate trim that is added but your Etsy pic above looks like the waist is knitted in one piece with the top portion.

Incidentally, I doubt that set is from the '40s or '50s - from what I can see of the labels, they provide quite a bit of information. If we could see the labels it would help but I suspect they'll be '70s or more recent.

 

Thank you: yes, the wool symbol suggests it's post '64. Does it have anything on the other side or any other labels? I suspect they're from the '70s or '80s, judging by amount of info, and fonts.

I found this that has a date of 1968 for the filing of the trademark but also found an advert from '63 so they were around earlier.

You're not the only one who attributes the style to earlier times: I found one on etsy that was sold as '50s although the label has measurements in cm, which I don't think the UK was using until the '60s or even '70s. In Australia, we tended to follow the British way and introduced centimetres in sizing labels in the late '60s.

 

As for Melanie's garment. It's almost definitely machine knit. In fact, never mind almost. It's machine knit. Some collar or turtleneck was cut off, then overstitched (you know, like a blanket stitch to prevent it from unraveling -- not sure of the proper term) and then gussied up by hand with a line of crochet. Nice work.

Linda, that sort of lightweight wool/cotton (or sometimes silk) long underwear (aka "long johns") are readily available -- cheaper models are at Target (I wear them as pajamas, as they don't bunch up around your legs at night the way typical wide-leg pajamas and nightgowns tend to do). Nicer ones you can find in "Yankee" and higher-end outdoorsy catalogs. Here are some nice modern ones:

http://www.vermontcountrystore.com/...ong_Underwear/Merino_Wool_Pointelle_Top/37476

http://www.llbean.com/llb/shop/75209?feat=75211-ppxs&dds=y

Nicole -- Jockey? You mean this old American underwear company: http://www.jockey.com/ourcompany/ourhistory? Or is there also a New Zealand underwear company by the same name? FYI, if it's the U.S. one, and you like their stuff (all my panties are Jockey, and yes, TMI, I realize), there's an outlet shop on the way to my lake house. Just another reason to come visit ; ).

 

Liza, I want to come and see you at your lake house so much! Hopefully one day :sunshine:

I don't know anything about the NZ Jockey except that they're owned by the Aus company "Bonds", which in turn is owned by Pacific Brands - but their Jockey page talks about being established over 150 years ago so I agree that it's likely to be the same one. Of course they don't say where the brand originated. I'm pretty sure we have (US) Jockey products here in Aus too. The only reason I know about them is that I bought those spencers from the brand the ladies in the shop told me it was a NZ company owned by Bonds (which meant I got a discount as they had a sale on Bonds).