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help dating three piece antique dress set

Discussion in 'PUBLIC Vintage Fashion - Ask Questions Get Answers' started by blubirdboutique, Jul 6, 2020.

  1. blubirdboutique

    blubirdboutique Registered Guest

    I believe this is older - 1800s but I am not sure how to narrow it down. Seems like a bustle dress (two skirts - one with draw strings inside to cinch it up) and a matching button down shirt. Missing the hook and eye closures on the skirt. Various stains but overall in good condition except the waistband is a bit shredded. MOP buttons. I believe the woman who sold it to me said she found it in an old cabin with additional older clothing items in MA. I will double check with her. Thank you!

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    Last edited: Jul 7, 2020
  2. This is the piece you asked about in Got Vintage, correct?
    I still say it is newer in parts. The buttons are much newer as is the lace trim.
    The style just doesnt match up to any antique pieces I have handled in my many years.

    It could have been reworked as a costume. Parts do look older.
     
  3. poppysvintageclothing

    poppysvintageclothing VFG Board Member Staff Member VFG Past President

    The shape of the blouse makes me wonder if it was for maternity wear? What are the waistbands on the skirt like?
     
  4. blubirdboutique

    blubirdboutique Registered Guest

    I'm going to update with additional photographs because I think it's hard to see on the ground. I believe (I need to double check) but the woman I bought it from said she found it with some older clothing in an old cabin in MA. I found a very similar authentic set on etsy with the same plaid fabric and all that was being sold as 1880s as workwear/prarie set. It definitely seems legit by handling it but I of course like to hear everyone's opinions here and I'm not great with dating older pieces.
     
  5. blubirdboutique

    blubirdboutique Registered Guest

    I'm going to update with additional photographs because I think it's hard to see on the ground. I believe (I need to double check) but the woman I bought it from said she found it with some older clothing in an old cabin in MA. I found a very similar authentic set on etsy with the same plaid fabric and all that was being sold as 1880s as workwear/prarie set. It definitely seems legit by handling it but I of course like to hear everyone's opinions here and I'm not great with dating older pieces.
     
  6. blubirdboutique

    blubirdboutique Registered Guest

    Also - I would say the waistbands are pretty tight. No more than 25-26". The shirt is looser in construction but still is cinched with a defined waist although it's hard to tell in the front.
     
    poppysvintageclothing likes this.
  7. Rue_de_la_Paix

    Rue_de_la_Paix VFG Member

    I love that fabric. The dress looks right to me for 1880s. I agree the buttons might be replacements as I would expect shank buttons for this. The lace may have been added later, but could be original. It looks to be knit lace, not crochet lace. With an added bustle underneath, that might pull the front of the bodice in to give it a better line.

    Hard to be sure without handling it, but it looks right to me for a country lady's home made dress.
     
  8. claireshaeffer

    claireshaeffer VFG Member

    I would like a better photo of the lace.
    Barbara, I think it looks more like crochet, but it's hard to see easily.
     
  9. Retro Ruth

    Retro Ruth VFG Member Staff Member

    I'm not seeing knit or crochet on that lace, but I would also need a better close-up.

    I think it might be a bobbin or needle lace.
     
  10. pastperfect2

    pastperfect2 Alumni +

    I agree with Barbara. I think it's 1880s with a smallish bustle and petticoat, which would change the bodice shape. The buttons not being shank style doesn't bother me as I've seen both styles on these bodices. As a possibly washable country dress, this button would be fine to me. That's if they are mother of pearl, of course!
    Has the bodice been altered at all?
     
    The Vintage Merchant likes this.
  11. The further pictures help. I still say parts of it are reworked or replaced, but it does have an early 1900 style while on the mannequin
     
    blubirdboutique likes this.
  12. blubirdboutique

    blubirdboutique Registered Guest

    Thanks! Did you see the one photo of the lace? I tried to get a close up.
     
  13. blubirdboutique

    blubirdboutique Registered Guest

    Thanks! I don't think it looks altered from what I can tell.
     
  14. Rue_de_la_Paix

    Rue_de_la_Paix VFG Member

    In the close ups added, I do not think it is knit lace after all.
     
  15. Retro Ruth

    Retro Ruth VFG Member Staff Member

    It's definitely not knit or crochet, which are both from a single strand and wouldn't have those strands that go diagonally.

    I'm fairly certain it's a bobbin lace. I don't know enough to know which type or whether it's as old as the dress.
     
    Last edited: Jul 8, 2020
    blubirdboutique likes this.
  16. blubirdboutique

    blubirdboutique Registered Guest

    Interesting story behind the dress. The woman who "found" it said about 50 years ago she was hiking in the deep woods of Mass and came across an abandoned cabin. She said she found this dress there a long with several other very old items. I have another skirt she found there I will post for reference. I'm guessing the dress is all original.
     
  17. Classic 1880s day dress. The buttons could be replacement.
     
    blubirdboutique likes this.
  18. MagsRags

    MagsRags VFG President Staff Member

    I agree with Claire that the lace looks like crochet - when I enlarge it, I can see the tiny chain stitch patterns.
     
  19. Retro Ruth

    Retro Ruth VFG Member Staff Member

    I both knit and crochet, and I'm fairly sure you can't make this lace structure with either technique. A better close up though, would help.

    This looks like a multiple thread technique (knit and crochet are both single thread techniques). The telltale sign for me is the threads that are going diagonally in two directions across the lace, intersecting with horizontal strands to make something like a six-pointed star of two overlapping triangles. You can't do that with a single thread, and I'm not seeing crochet stitches. You can do this with bobbins and multiple threads, and I'm pretty sure this is a bobbin lace, possibly Torchon lace?

    AFAIK this doesn't rule out it being machine made lace, and bobbin lace machines have been around for a long time.

    Screen Shot 2020-07-17 at 10.18.25.png

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    Here's an illustration of how that six pointed star is made in bobbin lace - see the central image called Half stitch. I think the construction looks very similar to the close-ups above, although there it's combined with other stitches.

    [​IMG]

    Although I haven't made bobbin lace yet, I've just inherited a set of bobbins and a lace pillow, so I've been looking into it, and expanding my lace knowledge.
     
    Last edited: Jul 17, 2020
  20. blubirdboutique

    blubirdboutique Registered Guest

    Interesting thank you!!
     
    Retro Ruth likes this.

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