1940s wide brim New York Creations hat: Straw or synthetic?

MagsRags

MagsRags

VFG President
Staff member
I am not confident of my ability to differentiate natural vs synthetic when it comes to hats! I'm hoping Barbara, our millinery expert comes by, but would love to hear opinions from others as well.

The hat
sunnylandside.jpg


The tag, which also give a closeup of the material
sunnytaga.jpg
 
Maggie, it's my understanding that synthetic materials were not available for the garment trade until post-WW2. The first synthetic was nylon, and later in the '50s, various polyesters were invented.

I think it's unlikely that either material was used in hats during the 1940s although nylon was common in '60s hats.

This looks like (natural) straw to me.

Nicole
 
Barbara ID'ed it as synthetic straw, made to imitate Milan braid
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They do look very similar, except for yours being wider brimmed. What materials were used for synthetic straw?
 
Well, is is very difficult to be sure from a photo. Having it in hand makes it easy. I think your hat is a coated natural straw braid, but again would need a closer examination to be sure. If you can scrape a little bit of the surface in an unseen place or take a snippet it will give clues.

As far as synthetics being used in fashions, the term synthetic can be subjective. Rayon is made from plants (cellulose) , a natural source, but is not always considered a natural fiber, to some people it is a natural fiber and to others it is a synthetic. My opinion falls somewhere in between. A synthetic made from natural substances. Anyway.....

Synthetics straw braids for hats have been in use as far back as the Edwardian era. There are a number of materials used and trade names applied to these straws. In the antique hats they used what was called Pyroxylin straw or "crin" (crinoline) and other types which were usually cellulose based (cello). Synthetic straws were made of cellulose, toxic chemicals, paper, paints, or a mix of those materials. Often natural straws were treated, mixed with these materials or straw was coated with lacquer, etc. Companies who made some of these synthetics closely guarded their recipes so we do not often know exactly what is in there. Most were made in Europe so during WWII we tend to see more of the coated natural straws. But synthetics were still around then also.

And natural straws were coated to add color, sheen and stiffness, especially if the straw was very narrow. Natural Milan straw has a wonderful sturdy feel and stiffness even if very narrow, and cheaper straw were often softer so they added a coating to give them more firmness to keep the hat's shape.

After WWII yes we see more plastic based materials used (nylons, etc), especially the straws coming from Switzerland and Italy.

Too much information, I know.

Sorry I cannot be sure on your hat, but would know if I had it in hand.
 
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Too much information, I know.
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No, definitely not too much. Thank you so much for sharing all of this.

I think your hat is a coated natural straw braid, but again would need a closer examination to be sure.
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At first glance at both hats as a whole - mine and Marsha's - the materials look identical. But looking again at my label photo, I am guessing that you suspect coated natural straw because the color is not completely uniform. There are lighter flecks here and there that suggest the dark brown color is overlaid - am I interpreting correctly?
 
I was reading about toyo straw, in my research on these two hats and my own, but I couldn't find when that practice started - and, that's another one that's quasi natural/synthetic. No idea if that practice was done in the 40s or outside of Japan. Down all the rabbit holes!
 
Thanks for the detailed response, Barbara. You're right about synthetics of course: I tend to consider the earlier (rayon etc) materials as 'man-made' as they are made of natural, not synthetic, fibres, but the terms are used widely and interchangeably.

I really appreciate your in-depth knowledge in these areas.

Nicole
 
I always think of Toyo straw as paper straw. I had not seen it used in hats much until maybe the inexpensive summer hats of 1980s, 1990s or around that time. I have not done any research on when that use started or if it is still made of all paper, a blend, etc. I have seen men's hats made of Toyo also. I avoid it in my own hat making as it does not hold up well especially in wet weather!
 
Thanks, Barbara! I just started reading about non-straw/straw hats and got fascinated by Toyo! I could not find a resource that dated the practice, and the only examples that admitted being Toyo were, as you said, cheap 80s and 90s. I just got really interested in what else, besides Raffia and wheat straw were used. And, some of my 40s ones are so pliable and consistently un-aged, compared to the definitely natural ones with possibly permanent creases. This thread has re-peaked my interest!
 
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