Anyone good at Dating Antique Beaded Purses?

Bombshell*Frocks

Bombshell*Frocks

Alumni
I purchased 5 beaded bags at an antique store a few weeks ago and need some help dating them...

I am clueless on these....as you will soon see, I can't even describe them...

TIA
First is a black beaded bag with pink, green, blue and yellow beads. I believe the frame is bakelite and lined in a floral fabric.

<img src="http://images.channeladvisor.com/Sell/SSProfiles/30030714/Images/20s%20Black%20Beaded%20Bag%20A.JPG">
<img src="http://images.channeladvisor.com/Sell/SSProfiles/30030714/Images/20s%20Black%20Beaded%20Bag%20D.jpg">
<img src="http://images.channeladvisor.com/Sell/SSProfiles/30030714/Images/20s%20Black%20Beaded%20Bag%20E.jpg"><img src="http://images.channeladvisor.com/Sell/SSProfiles/30030714/Images/20s%20Black%20Beaded%20Bag%20F.jpg">

The second bag has a red wool background with black, white, and clear beads and silver and gold irridescent beads on the bag body, the fringe is beaded with larger black and white beads, it is lined in black silk and has a twisted silk rope handle.

<img src="http://images.channeladvisor.com/Sell/SSProfiles/30030714/Images/20s%20Red%20Beaded%20Bag%20%20B.JPG">
<img src="http://images.channeladvisor.com/Sell/SSProfiles/30030714/Images/20s%20Red%20Beaded%20Bag%20%20C.JPG">
<img src="http://images.channeladvisor.com/Sell/SSProfiles/30030714/Images/20s%20Red%20Beaded%20Bag%20%20F.JPG">

The third one has an awesome bakelite frame and is a black silk faille? with black and white beads in various shapes and sizes...I am going to show alot of pictures of this one...

<img src="http://images.channeladvisor.com/Sell/SSProfiles/30030714/Images/30s%20Black%20White%20Beaded%20Bag%20A.jpg">
<img src="http://images.channeladvisor.com/Sell/SSProfiles/30030714/Images/30s%20Black%20White%20Beaded%20Bag%20B.jpg">
<img src="http://images.channeladvisor.com/Sell/SSProfiles/30030714/Images/30s%20Black%20White%20Beaded%20Bag%20E.JPG">
<img src="http://images.channeladvisor.com/Sell/SSProfiles/30030714/Images/30s%20Black%20White%20Beaded%20Bag%20F.JPG">
<img src="http://images.channeladvisor.com/Sell/SSProfiles/30030714/Images/30s%20Black%20White%20Beaded%20Bag%20G.JPG">
<img src="http://images.channeladvisor.com/Sell/SSProfiles/30030714/Images/30s%20Black%20White%20Beaded%20Bag%20H.JPG">
<img src="http://images.channeladvisor.com/Sell/SSProfiles/30030714/Images/30s%20Black%20White%20Beaded%20Bag%20I.jpg">

The last one is a white beaded bag that is labeled made in Belgium.

<img src="http://images.channeladvisor.com/Sell/SSProfiles/30030714/Images/Belgium%20Beaded%20Bag%20A.jpg">
<img src="http://images.channeladvisor.com/Sell/SSProfiles/30030714/Images/Belgium%20Beaded%20Bag%20C.jpg">
<img src="http://images.channeladvisor.com/Sell/SSProfiles/30030714/Images/Belgium%20Beaded%20Bag%20E.jpg">
<img src="http://images.channeladvisor.com/Sell/SSProfiles/30030714/Images/Belgium%20Beaded%20Bag%20F.jpg">

The fifth bag I have listed, I went with 30's and am really selling the frame as the suede on the bag is ripped away from the frame on one side.
Any help would be greatly appreciated!
Thanks!
Tori
 
Here are the plastic tests Tori that you were wondering about elsewhere...you were wondering about celluloid

Quoting

""Celluloid was one of the first plastics to be widely used in making jewelry. Celluloid was originally developed in England in the 1850s but first commercialized in 1868 by John Wesley Hyatt, whose company eventually became the American Celluloid and Chemical Manufacturing Company-- subsequently the Celanese Corporation. Jewelry made of celluloid dates to about 1900 and was quite popular during the art deco period. Celluloid has characteristics which are different from other plastics. Celluloid items tend to be thinner and lighter than Bakelite, and it is definitely more brittle and can crack when heated to higher temperatures. Some celluloid pieces can even be flammable, and while more brittle than Bakelite it can still be bent or twisted. Under hot water, most celluloid has a smell like vinegar or old camphor. Celluloid jewelry can be damaged by moisture, temperature extremes, or chemicals. Celluloid that has been stored in a closed environment for long periods can also dull quite dramatically and even crack.

The best and safest way to test and identify vintage plastics is with simichrome polish which you can purchase at most hardware stores. It's somewhat expensive, but it is also great for polishing Bakelite, silver, and most any metal. Polished Bakelite will leave a yellow residue on the cloth regardless of what color the Bakelite is. Another good way to test for Bakelite is to hold it under hot water for about 30 seconds and then smell it. Bakelite has a very distinct odor somewhat like a shellac. If there is no odor, it's likely the piece is Lucite Dow Bathroom Cleaner is widely used to test vintage plastics, but you have to be very careful not to harm any gloss finishes on the the piece being tested. Test this method on a small area first on the back or inside of a piece. Spray a small amount of Dow Cleaner on a swab and rub it on the test area for a few seconds. If the swab develops a yellow color regardless of the color of the plastic, the piece is probably Bakelite To be safe, wash the tested area immediately with warm water since it can damage the finish. You can also use Formula 409 in the same way as Dow, and it's probably safer for the Bakelite You can strip the finish or gloss from Bakelite if you rub too hard, making it dull and hard to restore. If you inadvertently do this, use simichrome polish to attempt to restore the finish. If necessary, repeat the polishing several times. Some people also use car wax to attempt this, but personally I prefer simichrome. It is possible for Bakelite to fail one of these tests if the piece is dirty, has an applied finish or sealant not original to the piece, or which has a damaged finish.
 
Hi Tori!

Beaded bags are hard to date as patterns were used for years and newer bags might be made out of old beads.

I believe the first and third are 1910 - 1925, and the handle on the first is probably celluloid. The second might be a little older , maybe 1900 - 1920.

The last one is somewhere in that range, but the Made in Belgium label is throwing me. The style is old, but the label indicates 20s - 30s to me.

Well, that's my shot at it - anyone else?

Hollis
 
You know Hollis, fringed bags throw me off. Unless they are the flapper revival thing, I always think they are 1920s, so I always hesitate to state that thinking I must be wrong.
 
Wow! Thanks for all the great information! And the dating Hollis!

I tried the simichrome test and came up negative, but that test is not always accurate.

I guess I'll just list them as 1900's to 1930's that way I'll cover myself.


Tori
 
The red one with the needlework background is made from a Victorian panel, probably a shelf or mantle pelmet, but it was made into a bag in the 1920s. The white one confuses me too, and Hollis and I agree on the 1&3, of which I think #3 is definately into the 20s and #1 is likely into the teens.
 
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