atticville
Alumni
I've read several definitions and have seen a few picture comparisons, but I still have trouble identifying Chantilly Lace. Is there a trick or is it practice makes perfect?:help:
Chantilly Lace-How do I identify?
- Thread starter atticville
- Start date
claireshaeffer
VFG Member
Chantilly has large flowers usually; alencon has small ones. Both are available at many price points. Chantilly is often reembroidered, beaded, or embellished with ribbon. are
If you have photos, I'll try to help. Claire
If you have photos, I'll try to help. Claire
secondlooks
Alumni
these are quick shots of part of an article on lace from a 50s AMERICAN TEXTILE mag I am looking at, perhaps they may help
secondlooks
Alumni
sorry, those are not very good pics. I can take better shots tomorrrow if anyone is interested. I love these AT magazines ecuase they are loaded with fabric swatches and have great articles. here's a bit larger photo of the first one.
atticville
Alumni
I'll be back with photos with my question items Claire!
Second looks, are those catalogs available?
Second looks, are those catalogs available?
atticville
Alumni
The Three I am wondering about:
A beautiful pre-20's "picture" tulip dress of silk(thank you Marian of Vintage Vanities) A decadent slip of:
A beautiful pre-20's "picture" tulip dress of silk(thank you Marian of Vintage Vanities) A decadent slip of:
secondlooks
Alumni
I'm not sure, the ones I have are from the 40s-60s that I found at an antiques mall. I learned later they were industry magazines.
claireshaeffer
VFG Member
The beige on pink lace is not chantilly. It appears to have a "unique" pineapple design. It's very pretty and because of the design unusual.
The white lace appears to be an allover lace. These are freqeuntly inexpensive but I have a Givenchy couture dress with an allover lace. I would look for differences in the lace patterns on the lace itself. There is some info in my Fabric Sewing Guide that will help you decide whether it's cheap or not. The old editions should be very cheap and the section on laces in it and the 2nd edition aren't terribly different.
The black is a high quality Chantilly. Using it as a guide, look at these sections: the ground (net) has several different patterns which makes it more interesting than a single background. The motifs (design) also have different patterns. This appears to be a flat, very delicate design. The yarns can be heavier with cording around the edges of the motifs.
If you have other laces or fragments, I can help you with quality and to some extent with lace types: chantilly, cluny, etc. Claire
The white lace appears to be an allover lace. These are freqeuntly inexpensive but I have a Givenchy couture dress with an allover lace. I would look for differences in the lace patterns on the lace itself. There is some info in my Fabric Sewing Guide that will help you decide whether it's cheap or not. The old editions should be very cheap and the section on laces in it and the 2nd edition aren't terribly different.
The black is a high quality Chantilly. Using it as a guide, look at these sections: the ground (net) has several different patterns which makes it more interesting than a single background. The motifs (design) also have different patterns. This appears to be a flat, very delicate design. The yarns can be heavier with cording around the edges of the motifs.
If you have other laces or fragments, I can help you with quality and to some extent with lace types: chantilly, cluny, etc. Claire
amandainvermont
VFG Member
Oh those American Textile magazines look wonderful! And KK I wish I could get to your place!
atticville
Alumni
Well, Everyone is Welcome to come on by !!
Claire, Darn you're good! I'll try to get some better pics of the white(which is really blue) And the first on is pre-20's and has gold thread work. Thanks Everyone!!
claireshaeffer
VFG Member
Anytime you have metallic in early 20th c. it would add value because it's real metallic. Later, it's generally a metallic look-alike.
Costume historians, can you relate a historical event in early 20c.--either Philippines or Hawaii that might have influenced the lace design.
I have several lace books and will try to review them over the week-end with one or two recommendations.
There is an article in the current Vogue Pattern Mag. with photos that might be helpful. Unfortunately, there are several errors.C
Costume historians, can you relate a historical event in early 20c.--either Philippines or Hawaii that might have influenced the lace design.
I have several lace books and will try to review them over the week-end with one or two recommendations.
There is an article in the current Vogue Pattern Mag. with photos that might be helpful. Unfortunately, there are several errors.C
ALoha,
This is a "way out" possibilty: The Royal Hawaiian Hotel aka the Pink Palace opened in 1927 with a gala. Maybe the dress or the lace was created for this event.
The hotel recently completed major renovations and is having a new gala reopening this Saturday. Here's a link and photo of the hotel on Wikikpedia:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Royal_Hawaiian_Hotel
If you do a search for Royal Hawaiian Gala Reopening all sorts of links come up including two articles in the online edition of the Honolulu Advertiser.
Linn
This is a "way out" possibilty: The Royal Hawaiian Hotel aka the Pink Palace opened in 1927 with a gala. Maybe the dress or the lace was created for this event.
The hotel recently completed major renovations and is having a new gala reopening this Saturday. Here's a link and photo of the hotel on Wikikpedia:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Royal_Hawaiian_Hotel
If you do a search for Royal Hawaiian Gala Reopening all sorts of links come up including two articles in the online edition of the Honolulu Advertiser.
Linn
atticville
Alumni
The first pink silk dress came from Vintage Vanities and the Fabulous Marion told me: "I can't tell you about individual items but everything came from South Central Idaho. The area was settled under big irrigation projects in the early 1900's. Many of the settlers were extremely poor, but the financiers of the project had more means. These items came from estates (occasionally from estate auctions)"
claireshaeffer
VFG Member
I like the Royal Hawaiian Hotel story. The hotel is pink and so is the dress.
Is the design consistent with 1926 or 1927. C
Is the design consistent with 1926 or 1927. C
I think the design of the dress is consistent with 1926, but I think it's a real long-shot since KK knows the dress came from a Central Idaho Estate. However, people of means did travel to Honolulu - some even had winter homes here, so it's not impossible. When you asked about an historic event in the Phillipines or Hawaii, Claire, the Royal came to mind.
A quick internet search didn't produce any photos from the original gala. There were some in a vitrine at the hotel. I haven't been back since it reopened and am not attending the gala this weekend, but I'll look next time I go there.
Aloha,
Linn
A quick internet search didn't produce any photos from the original gala. There were some in a vitrine at the hotel. I haven't been back since it reopened and am not attending the gala this weekend, but I'll look next time I go there.
Aloha,
Linn
claireshaeffer
VFG Member
Linn,
Is there a possibility that the hotel would have an early guest list?
I can understand why anyone from Idaho might travel to HI for a winter vacation if they had the money.
When you consider the western winter vacation locations in the US, that's a bit early for Palm Springs and even though Redlands, CA was a major retreat since the 19thC., it was accessible from the east by railroad--but not from ID. Most easterns would have gone to FL (maybe Palm Beach). C
Is there a possibility that the hotel would have an early guest list?
I can understand why anyone from Idaho might travel to HI for a winter vacation if they had the money.
When you consider the western winter vacation locations in the US, that's a bit early for Palm Springs and even though Redlands, CA was a major retreat since the 19thC., it was accessible from the east by railroad--but not from ID. Most easterns would have gone to FL (maybe Palm Beach). C
KK, (or anyone, actually) good libraries will have copies of American Textile, sometimes in their art departments, sometimes in the research division. if you are near a good university, you should be able to find some.
little old University of Hawaii at Manoa had them, they can totally transport one for HOURS...
sigh. that was a great library.
also, i like Lin's idea about the Royal, too. and yes, loads of main-landers (including Idaho-ans? Idohoanites? Idahodians?) ) with money vacationed in the islands, of course.
also think the lace design looks like an abstracted pineapple.
little old University of Hawaii at Manoa had them, they can totally transport one for HOURS...
sigh. that was a great library.
also, i like Lin's idea about the Royal, too. and yes, loads of main-landers (including Idaho-ans? Idohoanites? Idahodians?) ) with money vacationed in the islands, of course.
also think the lace design looks like an abstracted pineapple.