Dating all leather nude shoes from 100yr old lady

[Pinkcoke]

These shoes come from the same 100 year old plus lady that owned the 1955 Clarks heels I posted.

I think they are the same era as the clarks pair or maybe earlier by the shape and strappyness but would like your thoughts.

Points to note:

The buckle is false and hides a popper fastening.

The sole appears to be fully leather and contains far more nails than I've ever seen in one shoe.

there is a handwritten word on the bottom of one shoe than I can't read - I don't think it's english maybe german- I can make out 'dilchen' though there does appear to be another letter before this - the previous mark is just a scribble.
They have 'Foreign Made' & (size) 4 stamped into the soles.

 

[Jonathan]

Its a tough call without handling them. The shoes are made by a traditionally trained shoemaker - they are actually over-made if that makes sense. The quality is something you wouldn't even begin to be able to find anywhere these days. They are most likely German - Germany was a big shoemaking country, like England and the U.S., and later Italy, Spain, Brazil, and China. However, I can't decide whether these are mid-late 1930s or late 40s - early 1950s. Obviously they aren't anytime from between 1939 and 1948 - because of the war and resconstruction this type of quality product didn't come out of Germany, so it has to be either just before or just after. I'm going to go with just after c. 1950 on the nose because there is something about the width of the toe, the D'Orsay (open sides) cut and the snap fastener that says postwar to me. I think they are made in an old-fashioned way, but in a good way - they aren't clumsy or matronly, just a little conservative but extremely good quality.

 

[Pinkcoke]

I know exactly what you mean about these being over-made - they look as though they could still last several decades. I'm amazed that none of the thread used for stitching has disintegrated yet - wouldn't it have been cotton or perhaps linen at that time?

What would you look for when handling them Jonathan?

I don't know how indicative these are of a either period or maybe they just back up the quality you've described but there are a few more things I've noticed since:
the insole of the toes show evidence of a horseshoe shape ring of nails into the sole,

there are two more nails on the outside edge of the shank
and I can see the machine foot indentations running around the inside of the zig zag edged insole

On that last note did the machine use remain the same in the maufacturing of shoes at these times?

Also the suede is the finest I've ever felt. Or maybe suede isn't the correct term? Virtually all the visible pile associated with suede has been removed until all I'm left with is a silky feeling leather.

I also read somewhere that nothing can be understood from the manufacturer's numbers or stamp on the inside of a shoe as it was individual to them - is this true?

Lastly would this have had a brand label originally?

 

[crinolinegirl]

Since you are in the UK like me, you see "Foreign Made" on things made AFTER WWII when Germany was occupied. They (the Allies) did not want another WW after the economic collapse of Germany after the first world war and the bitterness that ensued, so they encouraged Germany (well Western Germany anyways) to rebuild itself (LOL, can you tell that I paid attention in History class?). With things from Germany (and Japan) during the post war era, will always say "Foreign Made".

I'd go with what Jonathan said with late 1940's- very early 1950's.

On a side note, you know those cheap 1950's little "Made in Occupied Japan" figurines that you find in the US and Canada (my mum has loads of them), well here in the UK, they don't say that but instead "Foreign Made"!

Lei

 

[pastperfect2]

Are these doeskin?

Ah, the rise and fall of national boundaries: first we had 'Made in US Zone Germany', then 'Made in Western Germany', before the more permanent 'West Germany', finally 'Made in Germany' again.

We didn't have 'Foreign Made' here in the US, I don't believe.

Hollis

 

[Pinkcoke]

Ah very good point! Thanks Lei.

I'd forgotten about that -it's a good job I went back and looked at the shoes again (I had to take a brass rubbing to read the stamped 'Foreign Made'!!) only the 'made' was visible before the wear to the sole obscures it.

By the by I've just noticed you're in Leicester - I'm in Loughborough! not 30 mins away. It's a small world

I've never heard of doeskin before Hollis do you know it's characteristics? why would it be used instead of leather?

 

[crinolinegirl]

Hollis, "Foreign Made" is such a British term and part of the British mentality.:scratchchin:

Everywhere and everything outside of this island is "Foreign". Even Kraft Macaroni & Cheese when you occasionally find it at Asda (The UK division of Walmart), is in the "Foreign" food section. Heck, even though I have a British passport, I'm still a foreigner!:D

With things made in the later 1950's, you start to see Made in Western Germany but earlier than that, it's all Foreign.

LOL, a small world indeed! I was supposed to go to Loughborough today as well but we ended up going into the City Centre instead. I'm in South Wigston, not far from Blaby

Lei

 

[Jonathan]

I can't tell you what I would need to see - its maybe a bit of psychic intuition but mostly just a feeling for scale and proportion of heels, toes, minute construction details etc. Also, sometimes I don't know what I am looking for until I see it (which is why I hate it when store owners always ask what I want when I enter an antique store --- I don't know - let's make it a surprise shall we?) Anyway... good to know about the 'foreign made' insignia. I have seen it before, but I never realized it was probably on shoes made for the English market. The serrated edge sock lining (insole), painted sole, wheeling (indentations inside the edge of the sock lining), - these are all features typical of older shoes, so the company that made them very likely employed old shoemakers/machine operators/designers/managers etc. and just picked up making shoes, probably where they stopped making fashion shoes in lieu of army boots in 1939.

The shoes are machine made, but hand finished - the way quality Italian shoes are still made. The numbers inside the strap are telltale of a factory-made shoe, but sometimes machine made is better for things like construction stitching etc. The numbers are nonsensical unless you know the code of how to decipher them. It can mean a variety of things from size, style, and colour numbers, factory line id, and dates (but often by week number rather than day and month, so '089' could mean the 8th week of 1949 and you wouldn't know that unless you knew the coding they had.) I used to be able to read Bally pre WW2 codes and some Bata codes, but I have forgotten what they were now and even in Bata, each factory had a slightly different code.

Doeskin is the finest finished suede there is. It has been sanded down to the velvetiest finish possible.

 

[Pinkcoke]

Thankyou both for sharing all your knowledge I've learned a lot from just one pair of shoes and two great minds. :D