Help Dating Frank Olive black felt hat with bow
- Thread starter laurenm
- Start date
Rue_de_la_Paix
VFG Member
That is a really nice hat, and the fur felt is a very good quality. While it could be seen as a riding hat style, it is more of what would be called a take off on the "Eugenie" or "Empress Eugenie" which is a porkpie style that came into popularity in the late 1860s and has had several revivals over the centuries, once in the late 30s (and the style was worn into the 1940s as you mention). And that style came back again in the later 1980s and into the 1990s, during which time it was extremely popular again. Sometimes the brim is turned slightly up on the 1 side and there would be an ostrich feather.
The Empress wore that style while riding, and you see it in mid Victorian photos and paintings, and so it fits that "riding style "category too. Although technically it is not a riding hat. Sorry to disagree with Melanie, but the "Tally Ho" has nothing to do with the hat itself or the style of it. I have seen that exact same logo on other style hats. That is just the trade name of the fur felt that was imported and used to block the hat by Frank's studio. I knew Frank professionally, and recall the day he died, right before the Millinery Awards in NYC (early 1990s) and I remember the (way too short) memorial tribute they gave to him on stage. But I digress......
I just saw this post and do not remember right off the top of my head when he did his "Private" line of hats, but I think it was around the late 80s to 1990. Although I have a few of his hats with this label that look to be earlier, more late 70s and early 80s.
Whatever the date, it is a nice find. Most hats from that time are (inferior) wool felt. His private line as you might suspect had better materials (yours is a fur felt) overall and was higher priced. Although they still glued on the label!
If I can pinpoint the date better I will get back to you. We have a VFG Trade member here who has access to old news clippings and she might come along and help.
Thanks for sharing the hat, it brought back happy memories.
The Empress wore that style while riding, and you see it in mid Victorian photos and paintings, and so it fits that "riding style "category too. Although technically it is not a riding hat. Sorry to disagree with Melanie, but the "Tally Ho" has nothing to do with the hat itself or the style of it. I have seen that exact same logo on other style hats. That is just the trade name of the fur felt that was imported and used to block the hat by Frank's studio. I knew Frank professionally, and recall the day he died, right before the Millinery Awards in NYC (early 1990s) and I remember the (way too short) memorial tribute they gave to him on stage. But I digress......
I just saw this post and do not remember right off the top of my head when he did his "Private" line of hats, but I think it was around the late 80s to 1990. Although I have a few of his hats with this label that look to be earlier, more late 70s and early 80s.
Whatever the date, it is a nice find. Most hats from that time are (inferior) wool felt. His private line as you might suspect had better materials (yours is a fur felt) overall and was higher priced. Although they still glued on the label!
If I can pinpoint the date better I will get back to you. We have a VFG Trade member here who has access to old news clippings and she might come along and help.
Thanks for sharing the hat, it brought back happy memories.
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Robin of Frocksley
Registered Guest
Fantastic hat, Lauren! I could see this at a Derby party!
laurenm
Registered Guest
Thanks Everyone,
I did notice that the felt was softer than any felt I have felt! Almost like the sheared beaver baby powder feel. So I see in a few places (including our label resource entry on Olive) that the Private Collection was also 'known' as One of A Kind....any thoughts on that? also found these two awesome photos while inter-sleuthing......
I did notice that the felt was softer than any felt I have felt! Almost like the sheared beaver baby powder feel. So I see in a few places (including our label resource entry on Olive) that the Private Collection was also 'known' as One of A Kind....any thoughts on that? also found these two awesome photos while inter-sleuthing......
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Rue_de_la_Paix
VFG Member
Hi again. To answer your question, No, the Private Collection was not one-of-a-kind. I am 100% positive of this. The VFG label resource on him (which I have just now read for the 1st time) says something that vaguely intimates this but I think is actually saying something else. I think what that writer meant was that he still did one-of-a-kind hats for private clients. Which he did.
I did find a couple of online sources that mention they (Private Collection hats) were one-of-a-kind but those sources are incorrect.
From what I can gather, he did the Private Collection label as early as 1980, not sure how much earlier it went back.
None of the sources I looked at mentioned his work for Emme, which in my opinion is some of his best work ever (1950s and very early 60s) as they had the money for the best materials available and he designed for them both anonymous at first and later with his name on the Emme label. Chanda hats were nice too, but his work for Emme is by far superior, in general.
When I knew him his blond hair was salt and pepper. Super nice man.
I did find a couple of online sources that mention they (Private Collection hats) were one-of-a-kind but those sources are incorrect.
From what I can gather, he did the Private Collection label as early as 1980, not sure how much earlier it went back.
None of the sources I looked at mentioned his work for Emme, which in my opinion is some of his best work ever (1950s and very early 60s) as they had the money for the best materials available and he designed for them both anonymous at first and later with his name on the Emme label. Chanda hats were nice too, but his work for Emme is by far superior, in general.
When I knew him his blond hair was salt and pepper. Super nice man.
BonniesVintageClothesLine
VFG Member
I can just imagine that Mr. Olive would be a nice man.....I love most of the Frank Olive hats that I have had the pleasure of owning! This one does appear to be 1980s to me and is quite lovely!
lkranieri
VFG Member
I found ads for Frank Olive's Private Collection (or From My Private Collection) hats from at least 1978 through 1997. If I remember correctly the earlier end of that range referenced From My Private Collection while the later ads referred only to his Private Collection line. Both names were referred to as one of his millinery lines and were obviously not one-of-a-kind hats.
Rue_de_la_Paix
VFG Member
Thanks so much Lynne. I was hoping you would come through, as always!
BonniesVintageClothesLine
VFG Member
Diana certainly made that style popular and she wore it so beautifully....for that matter, she wore everything beautifully!
laurenm
Registered Guest
I know I was just cruising through some amazing stuff....the 'matching' thing probably not something anyone can do....seems like any style worked on her....I am the opposite! I had a boyfriend who could wear any hat (even very so called 'feminine' hats which he would put on as a joke and he always looked amazing!
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BonniesVintageClothesLine
VFG Member
She was such a lovely woman! Just read an interview in People magazine with Prince Harry and he is quick to acknowledge the great influence she had on his life and so many others.