Liberty's Ties- 40s? Women's or Men's?

VintageFray

VintageFray

Alumni
Liberty\'s Ties- 40s? Women\'s or Men\'s?

Hi everyone, and happy easter!

I found these silk crepe ties the other day, and it wasn't until after i purchased them that i discovered the liberty & co label. I think they're 40's, but I've seen 30's fabric similar, often made into blouses, so i thought I'd ask for a second opinion.

I'd also say that the ties are quite short, measuring about 43" in length. Was wondering if there is a possibility that these are ties for women? Any help appreciated! Thanks!

Oh and there isn't a similar label in the label resource, so if you'd like me to resize and post to the label thread let me know.

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Hmm... I've never seen Liberty ties from the 1930's. In fact I don't know when ties began to be sold in Liberty's. Anyone? I also felt that the label was later although Liberty labels are a minefield. Is the print on the label woven or printed? It's a bit blurry to me.

The ties are short but washing might have shrunk the fabric. The pattern for ties are typically cut on the bias and are comprised of three pieces. If possible, I would like to see the the reverse of the front blade (widest end of the tie) and a close up of the finishing and a seam. Top stitching on the right side was used on ties from the Thirties and is probably used on these ties to give some strength and if there isn't a lining. There are resources online - particularly Tana Lawn designs - to find out the name of the design printed on the fabric but it's a hunt. The small lovely floral prints for dress fabrics were introduced in the Thirties by Liberty I believe. Other manufacturers of course also produced these types of designs for silk and crepe.
 
Hiya, thanks everyone for your help. I'm glad I was in the right ball park at least, for wavering between 30's-40's.

The label is woven, and both ties have exactly the same one, sewn in the same place. From looking at the labels on the label resource, a question that sprang to mind was when Liberty dropped the "& co" from their label? This must have been sometime in the 30's, as the 1940s label shown does not have the "& co" on it.

thanks vertugarde- the ties are made from 3 pieces, and are not lined at the back- I'll try and post some photos. The ties have stiffener sewn in about 6" from the end, which stops as the tie starts to really narrow down.

The ties might have shrunk, although I don't think they have, as they are both, still, exactly the same length.

I would be great to find out the names of these fabrics, but i think it would be a long search, as you say.
 
If its short,it doesn't necessarily mean that they shrunk. We are so used to longer ties because windsor knots require a lot of length - but if a pratt knot was used, it wouldn't shorten the tie as much. The windsor knot wasn't really seen until post 1936 and then it probably took a few years to catch on with all. Maybe not right on target/might not mean anything in this case but its the miscellanea hanging around in my brain.
 
I agree with Chris that the shorter length doesn't mean the ties shrank. Early ties are a lot shorter, not just because of the knot used, but because the style was to have the tie end a few inches over the belt. If you look at pictures of men in shirt-and-tie or with an open jacket in the 30s/40s, they look almost silly to a modern eye, with the ties flapping around in mid-torso as if the dads have nabbed their sons' neckwear!

As a matter of fact, I'm wondering if this couldn't be a boy's/child's tie? 43" is VERY short (I would expect 46" or so in a 30s tie...)
 
The archivist at Liberty's is Anna Buruma. I would be inclined to contact her and find out more about these ties.

http://www.zoominfo.com/Search/PersonDetail.aspx?PersonID=25305847

Here is an interesting ad I found from The Montreal Gazette April 1928;

http://tinyurl.com/ye6gds9

So, I may be wrong about the reference to dating the introduction of tiny floral print designs - or more correctly the information I have is incorrect. These two designs may of course be later.

Target have a new range of Liberty designs - mainly floral from what I can see.
 
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