Navy Rayon Pokadot Dress

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Romancingthe40s

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1960's Like My Dress.jpg
I could use help in dating this rayon navy dress that I purchased on Mackinaw Island, Michigan. It was owned by a lady in her 60's-early 70's who recently moved there from Manhattan. Doing the math puts her wearing this dress in the 60's. It was supposedly made for her to wear in a fashion show in Manhattan. She said it was a 30's or 40's dress. I'm posting a picture of the seams which are pinked. The skirt has odd tiny tucks (1/8" deep max.) that make the skirt appear from the front like it was made in more pieces that it actually was. The tucks make the skirt MAYBE a 1/2" smaller? In researching, I discovered a dress pattern from the 60's that looks very much like the top of the dress. The quality of the sewing on the skirt is very good, the top not so much. Someone used dark green thread on most of it. But the less skillful stitching is in navy thread. I removed a newer fake pearl/gold button cluster from the neck band and replaced it with a button from my vintage button stash. Neckband has two square black snaps. It has serged and faded shoulder pads. The fabric is almost sheer. No zipper which makes it a challenge to get into. I love this dress. It feels so great on and it fits me perfectly!Vintage Dress Purse 002.JPGSummer 2012Vintage Dress 026.JPGSummer 2012Vintage Dress 023.JPGSummer 2012Vintage Dress 024.JPGVintage Dress Purse 018.JPG
 
No zipper...and what is happening at the back of the dress exactly. Is there a sash tie where the solid color is? Also at the top of the back, it appears to be a solid color as well.

It looks like a rayon chiffon from the photos. It also appears to be fairly high-waisted from the close up 2nd photo.

The patterning on the dress and the fabric both remind me of rayon chiffon dresses that I have had from the 40s or early 50s.

Without any zippers I don't see it being from the 60s.

I am sure others will come in with their comments as this one is a bit of a mystery due to its construction.

It looks great on you!
 
poppysvintageclothing said:
No zipper...and what is happening at the back of the dress exactly. Is there a sash tie where the solid color is? Also at the top of the back, it appears to be a solid color as well.

It looks like a rayon chiffon from the photos. It also appears to be fairly high-waisted from the close up 2nd photo.

The patterning on the dress and the fabric both remind me of rayon chiffon dresses that I have had from the 40s or early 50s.

Without any zippers I don't see it being from the 60s.

I am sure others will come in with their comments as this one is a bit of a mystery due to its construction.

It looks great on you!
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Thanks for the compliment and the information.

The ends of a headband are hanging down near the neck in the back. There is a solid sash tie at the back waist. I wouldn't say it's high-waisted like an empire waist, but it is very fitted.

It has a couple of holes. One in the front (maybe from catching on something while getting it on) and one on the sleeve cuff. With a black slip under it, you can't see either one of them. Do moths eat rayon?
 
Yes, moths eat rayon.

Home made dresses are tricky - and this one is trickier than most. I have a few questions.

- Can you please include a photo of the shoulder pads.
- What fabric is it? Perhaps a fabric shop can help you, or a burn test.
- Is there any sign that there was an opening at some point? Was the neckline secured with a snap or working button?
- How is the hem finished.
- Does the sash start at the sides or somewhere else?

The different colours of thread are curious: they suggest this dress could have been altered at some point. I'm inclined to agree that this dress is from the '60s but it includes elements from earlier eras so they need to be discounted (or the '60s discounted). I've seen home made dresses from the '60s without openings.

I'm confused about the dating information you give: you say "Doing the math puts her wearing this dress in the 60's" is this when she said she wore it or you taking her back to an age when you think she could have worn it? If it's the latter, I'd be careful because this is a very unreliable method of dating clothing. Is she was born in 1942, she would be 20 in 1962.

You say " It was supposedly made for her to wear in a fashion show in Manhattan" but that would imply a professional dressmaker, but this dress is not well made and a dress made by a professional in the '60s would have an opening, probably a zipper up the centre back. It's either home made or has been altered extensively.

Lastly you say "She said it was a 30's or 40's dress", this is the most confusing: she's not old enough to have had a dress of this time "made for her". A '30s or '40s dress might have shoulder pads, but they're rare in '60s dresses, especially of this style.

Her inconsistencies are confusing: sometimes a previous owner has helpful information but often I find they're forgetful and so it's best to listen to the dress and read the clues it's giving you.
 
I purchased this '60's dress last summer. It has no openings and is most likely home made, although it has an acetate lining so maybe not. No label or tags - or any fastenings of any kind. Since it is A-line it is not too hard to get on or off.

1960qus%20Cotton%20A-Line%20Print%20Dress.jpg


I'd like to see the shoulder pads and hem on your dress. Has it been shortened?

I agree it looks great on you!

Linn
 
The dress looks pretty 60s to me--I've had 2 or 3 60s' dresses with similarly styled bodices. The shape of the skirt, unless it has been hemmed up several inches, doesn't look 40s to me... I wouldn't put much emphasis on the lack of an opening, especially since it's homemade.

Your observation that the skirt is nicely made but not the top leads me to believe, as Nicole mentions, that it's been altered, perhaps quite a bit. The presence of shoulder pads throws me a bit, but if the dress were made specifically for someone, they may have been added for a better fit, or the dress may have been made by an "older" seamstress used to earlier construction who continued to use them. Hard to know on that point.
 
CircaVintageClothing said:
Yes, moths eat rayon.

Home made dresses are tricky - and this one is trickier than most. I have a few questions.

- Can you please include a photo of the shoulder pads.
- What fabric is it? Perhaps a fabric shop can help you, or a burn test.
- Is there any sign that there was an opening at some point? Was the neckline secured with a snap or working button?
- How is the hem finished.
- Does the sash start at the sides or somewhere else?

The different colours of thread are curious: they suggest this dress could have been altered at some point. I'm inclined to agree that this dress is from the '60s but it includes elements from earlier eras so they need to be discounted (or the '60s discounted). I've seen home made dresses from the '60s without openings.

I'm confused about the dating information you give: you say "Doing the math puts her wearing this dress in the 60's" is this when she said she wore it or you taking her back to an age when you think she could have worn it? If it's the latter, I'd be careful because this is a very unreliable method of dating clothing. Is she was born in 1942, she would be 20 in 1962.

You say " It was supposedly made for her to wear in a fashion show in Manhattan" but that would imply a professional dressmaker, but this dress is not well made and a dress made by a professional in the '60s would have an opening, probably a zipper up the centre back. It's either home made or has been altered extensively.

Lastly you say "She said it was a 30's or 40's dress", this is the most confusing: she's not old enough to have had a dress of this time "made for her". A '30s or '40s dress might have shoulder pads, but they're rare in '60s dresses, especially of this style.

Her inconsistencies are confusing: sometimes a previous owner has helpful information but often I find they're forgetful and so it's best to listen to the dress and read the clues it's giving you.
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Shoulder Pads 024.JPG It looks like the sides were taken in. I can see remnants of old stitching on the sides of the dress. One color was used for the top thread and another for the bobbin on the well made parts. Yet another color of thread (top and bobbin the same this time) goes down each side seam. There could have been a side zipper, but the original seam allowances were cut off. The sash attaches at the side seams. The neck is fastened with two black square snaps. The skirt hem and sleeve hems were done by machine with the dark green thread. I'll get more info on the fiber. The alterations were definitely not done by a professional. Parts of the skirt look like they might have been.

The dates she gave on the dress didn't make sense to me either and I'm just guessing that she might have worn it in the 60's but she couldn't remember any more than what she told the shop owner on the phone who relayed it to me while I was in the shop.
 
Thanks for the shoulder pad pic - it's the older style.

Interesting dress! When people alter clothing, especially if they cut off pieces, they muddy the water and make it hard to see what was there originally. If the hems are machine stitched (presumably, top stitched?) that suggests a more modern date, but they could be part of the alteration.

All in all, I'll go with a home made dress from the '60s that's had a few adventures since then.

It's lovely and it's great that it fits you and looks so nice.
 
All in all, I'll go with a home made dress from the '60s that's had a few adventures since then.

It's lovely and it's great that it fits you and looks so nice.
Click to expand...

I'm with Nicole on this! I'd even venture to say that the fabric looks as if it may be older than the 60s (I still have a lot of yardage from the 70s that I could use today to make dresses out of!), but it appears that the yardage and the dress have had some adventures!
 
CircaVintageClothing said:
Thanks for the shoulder pad pic - it's the older style.

Interesting dress! When people alter clothing, especially if they cut off pieces, they muddy the water and make it hard to see what was there originally. If the hems are machine stitched (presumably, top stitched?) that suggests a more modern date, but they could be part of the alteration.

All in all, I'll go with a home made dress from the '60s that's had a few adventures since then.

It's lovely and it's great that it fits you and looks so nice.
Click to expand...

I really appreciate your help. What a fun learning experience this is!
 
vintagebaubles said:
I'm with Nicole on this! I'd even venture to say that the fabric looks as if it may be older than the 60s (I still have a lot of yardage from the 70s that I could use today to make dresses out of!), but it appears that the yardage and the dress have had some adventures!
Click to expand...

Huge thanks. This is great fun!
 
Looking at a close-up of the fabric, the details of the construction and the shoulder pads, it looks to me like this dress is a 1940's rayon dress that has been remade/altered. substantially.

Linn
 
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