Pre-1960s Plastic Zipper [not nylon coil]

R

rosebudrose

Registered Guest
I recently found this gorgeous green dress, just wasting away on a rack, during my last treasure hunt. Even though the lace is starting to come apart, I snatched it up because it's gorgeous, but mostly because it has a plastic zipper. Not a nylon coil zipper, but one with individually molded plastic teeth. Now, the only early plastic zippers I've seen in person were on some 1930s Schiaparelli pieces at the Brooklyn Museum, which I couldn't get as close to as I would have liked, so I don't know if this is actually a 1950s [I'm guessing the dress is 50s] plastic zipper, or if it was added later. The stitching is a bit sloppy, but the whole dress seems to be handmade. The zipper pull says Waldes, and the underside of the joining mechanism says made in USA 82-I.

To be honest, I'm more interested in dating the zipper than the dress, as the dress has some cosmetic issues that probably can't be fixed without removing the lace overlay or adding some appliques, which is as good as chopping it apart :no:


celeryzipper.jpg

celeryfront.jpg
 
Here's some info from the Patent & Trademark site:

"Word Mark WALDES
Goods and Services (EXPIRED) IC 026. US 013. G & S:

SLIDE FASTENERS INCLUDING SLIDE FASTENERS MADE FROM NYLON PLASTIC.

FIRST USE: 19461101. USED IN ANOTHER FORM THE WORD "WALDES" IN THE FORM AND STYLESAS SHOWN WAS FIRST USED ON SAID GOODS AND HAS BEEN CONTINUOUSLY USED BY APPLICANT IN COMMERCE AMONG THE SEVERAL STATES WHICH MAY LAWFULLY BE REGULATED BY CONGRESS. FIRST USE IN COMMERCE: 19461101
Mark Drawing Code (3) DESIGN PLUS WORDS, LETTERS, AND/OR NUMBERS
Design Search Code 02.03.01 - Busts of women facing forward; Heads of women facing forward; Portraiture of women facing forward; Women - head, portraiture or busts facing forward
02.03.25 - Fans (women holding); Hobos (women); Weapons (women carrying); Women, other women including hobos, women holding fans and armed women
09.09.04 - Fasteners, snaps; Snaps (clothing)
26.03.03 - Incomplete ovals; Ovals, incomplete
26.03.17 - Concentric ovals; Concentric ovals and ovals within ovals; Ovals within ovals; Ovals, concentric
26.03.21 - Ovals that are completely or partially shaded
Serial Number 71515921
Filing Date January 17, 1947
Current Filing Basis 1A
Original Filing Basis 1A
Registration Number 0534171
Registration Date December 5, 1950
Owner (REGISTRANT) WALDES KOH-I-NOOR, INC. CORPORATION NEW YORK 47-10 AUSTEL PLACE LONG ISLAND CITY NEW YORK
Assignment Recorded ASSIGNMENT RECORDED
Prior Registrations 0329930;0385069;0419943
Disclaimer NO CLAIM IS MADE TO THE REPRESENTATION OF A SNAP FASTENER APPEARING IN THE DRAWING.
Description of Mark THE REPRESENTATION OF THE WOMAN SHOWN IN THE TRADE-MARK DRAWING IS FANCIFUL.
Type of Mark TRADEMARK
Register PRINCIPAL-2(F)-IN PART
Renewal 1ST RENEWAL 19701205
Live/Dead Indicator DEAD
Distinctiveness Limitation Statement OF THE ACT AS RESPECTS TO THE WORD "WALDES".
 
Hi rosebud!

Are the slider and pull tab made out of plastic also? Or are they metal?

I will be out all day, but when I get home this afternoon I will poke thru my zipper info to see what might help out with dating and Waldes plastic information. :)
 
The slider and pull are made of enameled metal, in a shade matching the plastic.

Anne- Unfortunately, the lace looks to have melted/shredded in a few large areas throughout, but the underlying fabric is completely sturdy.
 
I am waiting for Melanie on the zipper history but I have a sense the this dress is earlier rather than later. If Waldes zippers were not used before 1946 then it cannot be earlier but my first thought when you first posted was late '30's- early '40's. If 1946 is the earliest it can be then I think the dress is mid-late '40's - very early '50's. I definitely think the zipper is early and original.

Linn
 
Sorry for delay....
I was hunting and hoping to find a solid answer LOL

Could the zipper be original? I do not know :( The colors match very well and with such a color that would be a bit tricky to do if it is a replacement.

Here is what I do know and I hope some of this helps :)

I do not believe the zipper is from the first round of plastic zips (@1937-43) Those zippers are a bit chunkier- the teeth and hardware are bigger than their metal counterparts. Also, you would expect to see plastic hardware-slider, pull, bridge top, etc. The metal/plastic combo is seen in the second round of plastic.

Waldes company info is a little harder to find than the more prolific zipper companies, so I cannot say for sure when they began working with plastics. Many of the other zip co's were busy during the mid-50s trying to perfect a new plastic zip. By the late 50s there were nylon zips being manufactured and sold. Some of the early coil styles did not look so coil-like :), but they were not hooked teeth either.... so that is how yours is tricky. But is is possible that Waldes was trying teeth vs coil.

The pull on your zipper is double hinged. Double hinged pulls were not commonly seen after the late 40s. Not to say they did not exist, but not commonly seen any longer.

Waldes sliders were usually marked with one or two patent numbers, company name, made in usa, etc during the 30s and 40s so the lack of that info printed on your slider has me thinking yours is not *that* early. Also your pull is not the Waldes style that would have been seen on a dress placket zip of the 30s-early 40s.

I wish I had a better answer for you. Maybe someone will show up and have the answer. I am extremely curious. I have never seen that particular zipper before, I would love to be able to touch it :)
If anyone else has had that same zipper on a dress that would be super useful info by referencing the age of their garment. Waldes had some innovative zipper designs, so something outside of the box like plastic teeth before the others might not be so surprising.

Thanks for sharing :) If this is indeed a 40s-50s plastic teeth zip it is definitely a neat little gem and a great photo resource!
 
Although the interest is in the zipper I think this dress is c1955. That great mossy green colour was a fashionable around that time. Interesting zipper info Melanie. I thought the injection molding manufacturing process for plastic zippers existed in the early 1950's? I didn't know double hinged pulls were not not common after the late 1940's. Can you point me to a reference for this?
 
Hi vertugarde!
The process of injection molding for zippers was available - the 30s/40s plastic zips were molded :) What was being worked in the 50s was the plastic itself. Something more durable than had been used previously. In the end the nylon, and specifically the coil design won out as the norm because it is washable, flexible, not as easily breakable and such. (not so good with ironing though LOL ;) )

Once upon a time I did read a date when Talon switched to single hinge only, but I cannot remember the date or where I read it. Sorry :( As far as references concerning other makers, I have none specifically. maybe a random link here and there, but mostly just mental notes and observations from handling and collecting zippers and zipper company packaging, period resources and ephemera. I wish I has somewhere to point you to exactly, I love zippers and would certainly help out someone seeking out zipper info. Zippers rock :headbang:

I will stop blathering... do not want to hijack this thread.
 
Yay! I felt a bit silly posting just for the sake of the zipper, I'm glad there are others who feel the same way about it as I do. The plastic itself is really interesting- almost a tiny bit translucent. My initial thought on the dress was late 40's/early 50's, due to the peplum, length, interesting shade of green, but I wasn't really counting on it, due to the plastic zipper.

Still a mystery, but thanks for all of the amazing information!
 
I decided to take a break and sit at the pc - found myself researching Waldes zippers. I enjoyed it.

First, in looking at the dress I would say it’s late 40s or early 50s - that is, I agree with the others. The peplum, the color and the overall style. There is too much fabric to be early 40s due to the wartime restrictions. As to late 30s, I simply am not learned enough to speak about 30s unless it screams out the date.

I started reading a google book History Zipper by Robert Friedel. It mentioned the pioneering efforts of Jindrich Waldes. Not much more but I found myself reading page after page.

In researching Jindrich Waldes, I found there is a Waldes Museum in Prague; there is (was?) a Kohinoor Inc. that apparently connected to Waldes (Waldes Kohinoor Inc., 47-10 Hustel Place, Long Island, NY); and there have been 150 patents for Kohinoor.

Here’s one patent: Slide operated fastener
U.S. Patent US2045504 | Filed: -- | Issued: 06/23/1936
Assignee(s): JINDRICH WALDES | Inventor(s): JINDRICH WALDES

As mentioned above, I don’t think the dress is 30s and the patent date is just early approval.

The “FIRST USE: 19461101” may be correct but I’ve learned the “first use” dates are not written in stone. I’m a retired paralegal and worked with attorneys for twenty years. I could not imagine an attorney entering a date that was not actually “first use” unless they were too lazy to check or just sloppy. I came across one while researching a question on the VCA. It said “on or before” rather than “first use” and I thought that was strange. Somone (I forgot who) posted that they had worked for attorneys who did this type of work and they always entered the date determined by “on or before” and this was completely acceptable.

I started double-checking the first use dates by looking at display ads in archival newspapers. Sure enough, there were several that were clearly in use years and years before the date shown in the Trademark site.

I love the Trademark site and find it very helpful but I think it’s just one tool to use in determining the age of a garment.

Sorry this is so long … need to get up and get to work ....
 
Interesting...an original zipper. I really thought it a latter-date one. Learn so much here!
 
I think the mystery is solved :)

Lynne (lkranieri) found a few amazing newspaper articles and emailed them to me last night.

I have to cut and paste the relevant info, so will post again in a few minutes :)
 
Yay Lynne! :clapping: The info she found goes nicely with the patent info stated in the other posts. :)

FWIW, I tend to agree with those who have said the dress looks late 40s.
And I feel that zipper pull tab dates c.1949 :)

Also, I just want to say that I am so happy that all these pieces of the puzzle fell into place. Many people added lots of cool info they had dug up through researching. The VFG forums are such a great place! It's awesome to watch this kind of stuff happen. :)

Anyhoo, here's the basic overview of the articles which date 1949 & 1951:

Waldes manufactured plastic zips during the war due to shortages of metal. Consumers were unhappy with those zips. They cracked and melted easily.
Waldes wanted to find a plastic that was more practical & durable during use and cleaning.
Company introduced nylon zipper in 1946.
In 1949 George Waldes states his company is shipping 1 million nylon zippers per month. Also says they had introduced a type cover zip version in nylon.

:cool2:
 
You guys are the best! Melanie, eye*candy, all of you!

I wish it weren't damaged, as it is truly one of the most gorgeous colors I've seen in a while, and the plastic zipper is extra special! I think I will let this one go, as it is not a good color for me, and someone who knows what they're doing can take care of the broken lace.

This forum is a dream come true :clapping:
 
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